by Aurora Bordeaux
Dear Dudes: Where are the childfree among you? Come out, come out, wherever you are!
This is something I have often wondered, but it brings me to what I think is a serious double standard among men and women. If women don’t want kids, they’re childless (ack!) or childfree (better, but underused in polite society). But I’ve found that if dudes don’t want kids, they’re just… Dudes.
I’ve read bits and pieces from childfree men out there who openly don’t want kids, so I know they exist. This, however, brings me to another double standard—the vasectomy. If I hadn’t shown up to the hub’s consult, the doc wouldn’t have done the deed. He said too many men come in requesting the procedure, then get married and have children later. Or, if they’re already married, wives aren’t on board. What’s implied here: Men don’t want children, then their wives change their minds. In our marriage, I’ve always felt everyone but the hubs put the burden of “deciding when it’s time to have a baby” on me. Hence, when no kids come out, I’m the one to point at.
This is the same feeling I got from my mother in law, Milly (MIL-ly), when she and my father in law Phil (FIL) visited us over Thanksgiving. I can’t point to a specific comment or action, but my instincts screamed Milly thought her son deserved children and I had brainwashed him or was cockblocking him from having them. I truly believe that in her mind, it’s not the hubs that doesn’t want kids, it’s me. Society seems hooked on the notion that men never want kids, and women always should.
The hubs gets similar comments from guys at work all the time: “So when’s the wife going to give you the green light on kids? My two are a handful. Enjoy your freedom while you can! Ha. Ha.” The “ha’s” are never real, and they always say it with dead eyes. I know the men love their children, but they are also just tired a lot.
Lots of guys do want kids. I’ve known guys like this, and they can be adorable and wide-eyed, often showing a playful side where other dudes can be too cool for school. Some guys who want kids don’t seem to have much of a clue what kids are or mean (re: work). For the record, I think guys who want kids can also be perfectly normal people who, you know, just want kids.
But it seems like most of the time, guys don’t talk about wanting kids one way or another. Why is this?
I’m putting out a BOLO (be on the lookout) for childfree guys because I’m curious what your experience is like. Lots of other gals who pipe up on the Baby Off Board Forum have voiced the same quandaries. Besides that, our handful of childfree gentleman are looking for company. What is it like to be a childfree guy? How did you know and decide you didn’t want kids? Did you ever want them? Do people give you crap about it the same way they harass us ladies?
If you’re a childfree guy, think of this as your chance to have multitudes of ladies listening to you attentively. Or as a chance to connect with other childfree guys, who are currently awaiting you on the Forum and ready to bond—which is to say, in guy speak, to probably talk about neutral topics like sports and Call of Duty for a year or two before getting into anything serious. If you want to leave a comment on this post, that’s fantastic, too. I’m just genuinely curious to hear anything you have to say.
I know you’re lurking, CF Dudes. I can smell you from my laptop. Don’t be scared–I have free snacks. Come out and chat!
Azza D says:
One of my best friends is childfree and I may be going to the dr with him pretending to be his partner so he can get snipped. No one ever questions it with him though and it drives me insane because almost all our friends constantly tell me I’ll change my mind. One of our friends actually told me we should start dating because neither of us wants children (which seems like she’s saying you date people either because they do or don’t want kids, irrespective of other interests and factors).
Adam says:
Childfree and male here. In my experience it isn’t that childfree guys are accepted, it’s that we’re humored. Often when I tell people that I’m actively planning on not having children the conversation will nearly always end up going through a couple of mildly supportive but questioning comments before they ask what my wife’s plans are. When I say she feels the same it’s only then that it’s accepted. It’s essentially making sure I have permission from her to be childfree.
That seems to back up your experience with needing to weigh in on your husband’s vasectomy. While I am absolutely for openness in relationships, even if you show up and said “no” to the procedure it really should just be his choice. While not at that same level of urgency, it’s similar to how a woman doesn’t need to come in with the sperm side of a pregnancy to get an abortion or emergency contraception.
So yeah. On one hand I totally understand that women have much more pressure put on them because not only are they expected to want children (while guys are only expected to have them) but women are also responsible for making the choice for the men in their lives. I think if I were to start a childfree men’s blog it would be called “Adults with Permission Slips”.
Rachel L. says:
Adam, you are so right! My husband read your comment too (as I share much of Baby Off Board happenings with him) and said you are spot-on. Reproductive choices most times are decided by the woman. It’s her body that has to carry the child, push it out, deal with the physical and mental repercussions, and it is she who will provide a majority of the care and nurturing for the next “x” number of years. My husband said from the beginning he didn’t feel it was his place to deny me the experience of motherhood if that is what I wanted. He just said he would go along with whatever I chose. I told him that I feared the reverse was true: that maybe he wanted kids but didn’t feel like he could ask so much of me. In actuality he was relieved when I confessed no desire to be a parent.
I really feel for men who didn’t wish for kids, or just didn’t have enough time to really process what they wanted out of life, but found themselves in the father role because their wife/girlfriend went to a baby shower and came back crazy to “have a baby”. Guys- your fate is often determined by a woman’s hormone-addled mind or her self-professed “ticking biological clock”. The decision to become a parent should be given loads of consideration and careful planning with your involvement! Men should absolutely have equal say, but they feel unqualified to express themselves for fear of being made to feel guilty whatever the outcome (so says my hubby).
Jack says:
I’m 27 and I knew I wanted to be child free ever since I got my first real girlfriend and started thinking about the future when I was 17. In my experience all but one of my male friends is looking forward to having children, they’re either ambiguous or indifferent and seem to be fine with whatever their girlfriends/future wives want (none of my friends are married yet) or resolutely don’t want children. The topic hardly ever comes up anyway. I don’t experience any pressure at all to have children, probably because I’m single and have been for a while, but I do get people telling me I might change my mind later on. I think my dad would like grandchildren, but my mother has no such desire.
All in all I feel my decision is pretty accepted here and is considered to be barely worth talking about by the people around me. They’re all more worried that I will remain an immature video gaming man-child forever, hah.
Jack says:
Oh shoot, sometimes I changed the composition of a sentence while I’m writing it and forget to edit it properly.
I said “In my experience all but one of my male friends is looking forward to having children”
In reality I meant only one of my male friends is looking forward to having children.
Angi Ingalls Designs says:
(My man chimed in through me, hes not an internet person) Its so true! He is happily CF and often doesnt even come up. The only time is with his longlost reconnected friends (with kids) will do the “parent dance” in their manly ways about how great it is, you’ll change your mind, etc etc. Hes 42! I think his mind is set. LOL However, being a “man” – he wont get a vasectomy. Im looking into getting the procedure.
R says:
I’m a dude. Always thought I wanted kids…but now I’m really thinking I don’t. The wife is uncertain…in part leaning toward not but I guess it’s up to her. The day I learn she’s pregnant I will not be as happy as I act though…
Kevin says:
26 proud CF male here. I can tell you the reason no guys really talk about having kids or not – it’s just not socially acceptable. Guys talk to other guys about sports or cars or whatever, and if the topic of kids does come up, more emphasis is placed on the act of conception, if you know what I mean.
I got some real flak from my guy friends when I got my vasectomy done. In their eyes I had no reason to do it since I’m single, have no random baby mama drama, or stuff like that. I got snipped as a preventative measure, not as a reactive one, and securing my future and saving a hypothetical lovely lady the hassle of pills and operations were my reasons, and they’ve always been good enough for me.
I’m sure you can imagine how being “sterilized” automatically made me look like less of a man in their eyes. I always just told them it takes a real man to take multiple needle stabs and incision to the scrotum – it’s not wildly difficult to get someone pregnant. Holding my head up and not letting people talk down to me earned me their respect and closed their mouths.
I have had an insane time trying to find CF people in general – I belong to a couple forums and groups but they’re so small and it really make me wonder where the rest are – if they’re so busy being awesome that they don’t time to be lonely or if there really aren’t that many CFers around. I think women in general are more vocal about the whole kids thing then men are, and I think that’s really justified. It’s their bodies at stake, not mine.
Ali says:
Kevin – Thank you so much for posting! I admire and respect the way you hold your head up high about your vasectomy and stay true to yourself and your decision.
Lisa Marie says:
My Best Half isn’t an Internet person either, but we’ve talked about this issue a lot. He’s European, and I think that has a lot to do with why he feels OK expressing his CF-ness moreso than American men. He told me that he does think that women have a much rougher go of it than men do, for the reasons that other posters have described. But one thing he finds it very difficult to do is find like-minded male friends to pal around with. Most of the friends he has are those he met at work, and they’re all married with kids. They don’t have the freedom and flexibility that he does. I feel that this has made the “friendship” component of our relationship even stronger.
Steve says:
As a CF guy, I don’t get hassled as often as my wife does. When people do bingo me, like my doctor asking if I’m going to give my Mom a grandkid, it’s usually not sustained and doesn’t particularly bother me. If some people secretly pity me or think I’m not grown up, hearing a parent saying he envies me because I have a life is plenty consoling.
Xanther says:
My wife loves your blog and sometimes points out posts to me she thinks I’ll find particularly interesting. Since this was specifically up my alley, she of course had to share! So here’s the short version – might toss the full into the forum or something later…
As a 29 year old married CF male, I get the full gambit. When people get a “no” from me to the “kids?” question, I’ve had everything from “ok” (and we happily move on to a new topic) to pestering about how we “should” or that I’m somehow “wrong” (yes, even from people I met just 30 seconds prior!). And related to your post – I think maybe twice I’ve even gotten “oh, your wife doesn’t want any?” or “and your wife is ok with that?”.
But I used to work in Alumni Relations where a big chunk of my job was meeting new people, so I’m not talking a small sampling of experiences here…
Anyway, just wanted to say that yes, us dudes do get the same crap they give you ladies. Unfortunate we all have to deal with it, but at least there are some of us in it together!
Alison says:
I am a 36 and childfree and planning to stay that way. There are two things that I’ve noticed-
1. There is considerable regional variation in CF populations. When living in CA I had tons of CF friends, in FL I’m more of an oddity. This might explain why some of you CF dudes aren’t finding like-minded dudes.
2. I think others have a more difficult time accepting a CF decision because there are always opportunities to change your mind. Having children is a definitive choice that is irreversible. The choice to not have children can generally be reversed.
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Nathan says:
I’m a 50 year old childfree man, and happily so. My wife and I have been married for 26 years. Our conversation about having children when we hit 30 took all of two minutes before we both decided we just didn’t want any, and both breathed a great sigh of relief. No regrets!
I think I’ve always been childfree. I don’t ever remember wanting them. Perhaps I was born without any parental instinct, or perhaps it was that I was an only and comfortable with solitude. Besides, the other kids in the neighborhood broke my toys, and that pissed me off. The older I grew, the more children irritated me until by age 20, I couldn’t stand being around anyone under the age of 12. Still feel that way.
My parents never put any pressure on me to give them grandchildren. They supported me and understood. They couldn’t stand brats or kids who screamed in restaurants. My friends were the same way. People in our various churches were a different deal. I once had an usher say to me (referring to the “be fruitful and multiply” verse in Genesis), “If you won’t obey God’s first commandment, how will you obey the rest of them!” And another said “You owe it to God to raise up godly children as unto the Lord so they can join his army.” Still yet another, blaming my wife for our childfreedom, said “You just need to tell your wife to submit.”
So, I think for men, the pressure to have children comes from the culture they find themselves in. An easy-going culture will just smile and think he’ll grow out of it. More rigid cultures will bingo him like mad!
But, we childfree men are here, and we ain’t going to give up our childfreedom. Well, it’s too late now anyway!
Christian says:
I am 37 and CF by circumstance AND by choice. I consider it one of the greatest blessings that I am unable to procreate but I really respect other CF men that can/may procreate. I have never wanted children and, when I found out that I could not, I was thrilled. I get flack all the time from coworkers, especially women. They don’t understand why I wouldn’t want children and believe I would make a great father. I don’t argue, I would be a great father but I have no desire to adopt or find any other ways to ‘have’ children. I was married for 13-years to a woman who claimed to be child free but she did leave me for another man and had a child before we were even divorced (not sure if she truly didn’t want children or she just loved me enough to not care). I have been happily single for over 4-years now. I have two cats and love the solitude, peace and quiet. I have yet to find myself lonely or depressed. In fact, when overwhelmed with the presence of children, I find myself anxious and grouchy. I just think we are all very different and I can’t understand why that is hard for others to be at peace with. Thanks for the opportunity to share my story.
the CFdude says:
so, I’m in my bedroom with my 3 Labradors browsing the Googles for this very topic (just switched jobs mid-career to pursue a passion of mine *and to pursue a much, much bigger paycheck…took a week off between jobs, because beer, that’s why*), and came across this blog post. Anyway, here’s my story and take on the subject. I got snipped a few years back while I was still in the military. I dont know if they do it in civilian hospitals, but I had to have a pre-op interview before they did the procedure…and by interview, I mean the Urologist asked me 3 questions. She asked: 1. do you have kids? (nope.) 2. do you understand that this procedure is considered non-reversible? (Yep.) 3. Is your wife on board with this decision? (Yep.) And the rest is history. Piece of cake, right? Not so much with my wife. Without going into too much detail, she had some wellness issues, and asked for a procedure that would have fixed the issues completely, although it carried potential complications and would possibly void her ability to carry a pregnancy to term. The doctors refused, claiming that she might want kids someday (Trrrrust me. She won’t want kids Ev. Ver.) The point of my rant is that as a childfree dude, I don’t get alot of bingos from people, and it seems us dudes don’t get much flack in general. Even my own parents support our decision to be childfree. My wife is fully capable of making her own decisions. Its almost comical that her doctors (female doctors to boot) would essentially pat her on the head and send her on her way. Picture the Secret Service putting Obama in a child harness lest he wander off too far from the press room.
Another Kevin says:
27 Child-free, pet-free guy. I knew I never wanted kids, before I even knew what sex was. The more I learn about the stuff women have to go through to prevent pregnancy, the more I’m happy to take matters into my own hands. There’s no reason to screw up a lady’s body and hormones, when all I need is a little snip.
I had a vasectomy 3 years ago, and I find it quite worrisome that people who know about it still talk to me about “when I have kids one day.” Most people I have that conversation with cannot fathom even considering not having kids.
For those who say “Don’t you feel like less of a man?” I love replying “It takes balls to get a vasectomy.”
Unfortunately, where I live, not being obsessed with alcohol, drugs, sports and religion limits my social opportunities to near zero. I’ve averaged meeting 1 CF woman every 2 years. It gets more depressing when you consider that 2 of the last 3 I met were a lesbian and asexual. These odds have had me give up on dating for a few years now. On the plus side, I’ve managed to find 2 solid friends over the past year. Both of those buds have kids, of course. I would say I need to move, but where I live honestly isn’t too bad. I only need to find 1 partner, right? They’re just really good at hiding, or something.